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This chat room is for chatting about anything. Join in! Or if you have already
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Angela
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Angela1019
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Can any of you help me? I am looking for some good holocaust pictures? Do you know any good web sites?
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Angela
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Angela1019
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Can any of you help me? I am looking for some good holocaust pictures? Do you know any good web sites?
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John Carter
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17-2-98. You have to be a determinist to be scientific. Determinism just means not believing in causeless effects. When a determinist seeks to understand something, he looks for relevant material objects and forces. Men are of course objects. The popular journalistic view of determinism is that it leaves out 'the human factor'. Many British bourgeois philosophers still counterpose subject and object, the human observer from the object he's observing. The fact is that the human 'subject' is just another object - part of the system. His consciousness is also an object. The genesis of the 'on the one hand the material world, on the other consciousness' position (incidentally the only thing that passes for philosophy in Britain) is historical. It stems from religious thinking. For advocates of that position (nearly everybody), the ultimate causeless effect is God or a set of Gods. I suggest you move your thinking into the 20th century. Look up three words in the dictionary: determinism, scientific, materialism.
You'd better check what you mean by a deterministic model.
What do you think about the proposition that thoughts are physical? I'm wedded to a materialistic outlook. I really can't conceive of anything that isn't physical that actually exists. I admit I don't have all the answers. For example is a word physical? Or a number?
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Lu
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Mon. 16th Feb.Well! How do you attempt a
response to so many different issues in one
go? I guess, for the moment i'll try and
stick to the 'gene' thing!
Yes, a persons' genetic 'code' does influence
certain aspects of thier physical makeup- but
even that is by no means 'deterministic', a
persons'diet, lifestyle, proximity to
electricity pylons, etc. all play an equal,
if not greater role,in the overall
functioning of the body. Looking, then, at
something as nebulous as 'intelligence', say,
or 'personality', trying to use a
deterministic model is, not only horrifically
unscientific, it is also indicative of a
person being too fearful or confused to start
attempting to understand the very real
determinisms and limitations that we face, as
individuals and as a whole. This is not to
say, of course, that i am not 100% commited
to the exploration of the possibilties that a
knowledge of genetics opens up. Freewill...?
well, i'm no philosopher, but ido know that a
complete ban, in the States and in Bitain, on
the research being carried out on 'Germline'
therapy is a very dangerous thing- so, here's
to 'Keeping Science Live!' see you soon!
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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(13-2-98) As far as I know, your genes determine how you look. Why shouldn't they have an effect on what you do? I'm not saying they're the only influence. Other people have an effect too. Yes I am a determinist. However I consider freewill a useful myth. I've noticed that if you think you're free you act free. And some people are clearly more free than others. So they must have more of this thing... So it must exist... So it's real and not a myth. Can you help here? Incidentally, I'm not sure that in the realm of ideas old equals false and new equals true. But I do wish it was that simple. Also, I think arguing about the meaning of words (determinist, freedom for example) is usually unproductive. I'd rather argue about physical things and how they work and how we are going to make them work. How genes work and what effects they have interest me. How society works and what effect it has does too. What do I do? Anything I feel like. p.s. Just put the date in your message. I'll respond bye and bye.
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Lu
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baz-1@dial.pipex.com
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This mode of chat is maybe supposed to be
freeform and casual, but it seems to me, that
if people don't arrange a time to meet, then
this just isn't going to work! I'm very
interested in the 'Gene' discussion, John, so
it might be an idea to arrange a time to
chat. With regard to the comment you've
already made, which seemed to be accusing
Juliet of being a bit old hat, I would have
to say that a degeneration into your own
particular brand of biological determinism
seems far more retrograde in comparison. What
do you think? By the way, what do you do?
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Lu
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baz-1@dial.pipex.com
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This mode of chat is maybe supposed to be
freeform and casual, but it seems to me, that
if people don't arrange a time to meet, then
this just isn't going to work! I'm very
interested in the 'Gene' discussion, John, so
it might be an idea to arrange a time to
chat. With regard to the comment you've
already made, which seemed to be accusing
Juliet of being a bit old hat, I would have
to say that a degeneration into your own
particular brand of biological determinism
seems far more retrograde in comparison. What
do you think? By the way, what do you do?
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Stuart
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If someones here say Hello!
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x-ray
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hey, anybody there?
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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Juliet Tizzard says in the latest LM that "... the thing that really shapes us as humans is not so much our genes as our social experiences."This is an old debate. Perhaps we are approaching the time when the limitations / potentialities of our individual genetic birthrights can be quantified. How many human genes are there? What does each one do? Is it just a case of realizing one's 'built in' potential to the full or is the interaction between hardware (genes) and software / input / output more complex than this? If we want to be scientific about this (and I'm sure Juliet does), perhaps we should begin by discarding over-worked set-piece positions and get some evidence and start evaluating it. This is no longer a question of belief. It's a question of gathering and understanding facts.
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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That seems OK. Come on everyone. Let's sort the world out!!! The people currently in power don't really know what to do next. It's time for big changes. Incidentally, there are no dates on these comments. (27-1-98) But note that the most recent comments are at the top.
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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There seems to be a bug in this chat page. I wonder if this gets through.
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revolt@post.cz
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i'm looking for address of some cuban chats (for example chat of communistic youth), only in english or french, not spanish
please send me these addressesthanx companeros
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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Geoff. My major gripe against a social system based on a market is that it's so inefficient. For example, do we really need ALL those banks? And each of those banks' employees duplicating the same tasks? What are all those commuters actually producing that's of any real use? And why do they look so glum, mate? You know there are people in the city whose job it is to sell risks. They sell risks. Others sell money. Others (even more ridiculously) want to create jobs.
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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Zdenda. You're right. Capitalism is no way to enter a new century. However, I doubt you've experienced socialism, which I take to mean (as a minimum) self-government at the level of the individual.
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geoff
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geoffgb@alphalink.com.au
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would someone like to comment on whether
a market economy must be inherently more
efficient than a planned one
seems to me that the market is inconsistent
with the egalitarian goals of socialism
unless it is theoretically possible to
construct a society based on social ownership
and democratic planning then the
marxist/socialist project must be abandoned
......someone like to chat with me about
this?
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John Turville
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jpt23@cam.ac.uk
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Do you think that it is possible to achieve a
socialist utopian state through (Western) democratic
means when the superstructural elements of society
such as the media and education are so biased
in favour of the present administration
(for example, the lack of any formal teaching
of Marxist ideas before A-level standard etc.)?
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Richard
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rbelcham@rfh.org.uk
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Is is true that it is Jack Straw's son who
is in trouble with the law? Whiz or what?
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Damian Byrne
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dwb@tinet.ie
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I saw on the news today that Jack Straw is going to setup a national helpline for parents, and parenting classes which will actually be compulsory for the parents of "delinquents".Isn't it wonderful that we have Uncle Jack around to teach us how to raise our own children! How on earth did we cope before?
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zdenda
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where are you my socialist sisters and brothers? i am still waiting.
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zdenda
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i want to take back marxism to czech republic, i have live in capitalism for 8 years and it is bad, i am small bourgouis, but i love communism, death for capitalism, long live socialism
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Mom
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reedetc@clover.net
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Hi...I'm hoping someone has information I'm looking for...I heard a program on the radio, 640 AM, which featured a guest speaker who had available a video tape of, supposedly, some really futuristic-type weapons which, again supposedly, are actually being used by our government in situations of armed conflict. Does anyone know if I'm on the right track here or, even better, does anyone know the name of the guest speaker for whom I am searching? Thanks a lot for any help anyone can give...Happy Holidays! Thanks, Mom
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reginald
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hi! I'm reginald.
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iain bagnall
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f9480298@wlv.ac.uk
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I have to do an assessed discussion in
Spanish about Myra Hindley, like should she
or shouldn't she be released?
has anyone got any opinions/comments
or information they could send me?
thanks if you have.
iain.
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Lily
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Queen, if you are still there, i'm interested
in the same things. Capitalism will fail,
and probably soon. I think that something
needs to be done, and if there was a way that
everyone who felt this way could get together
and form some sort of a plan, then there
could be something done about it. A lot of
people don't realize that they could help, so
they just give up. I feel that way
sometimes...
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Manticore
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manticore48@hotmail.com
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Can anyone tell me of a good web site
pertaining to the topic of Ecotourism and its
encouragement on environmental imperialism
and degradation.
Thanks
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Manticore
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manticore48@hotmail.com
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Can anyone tell me of a good web site
pertaining to the topic of Ecotourism and its
encouragement on environmental imperialism
and degradation.
Thanks
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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Sparkle. See below.
p.s. I'm assuming nobody reads this junk.
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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In reply to Retro. I think you will find that in the future retro will have been thought to have been terribly avant garde for its time. Given the benefit of hindsight that we used to have. And may have again.
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John Carter
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john14@uel.ac.uk
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In reply to Fred. What I think about abortion on demand is that it's better than its being mandatory. Except in your case.
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Kyoun
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Some people may insists 'the freedom of speech' when it comes to censoring internet chatline. However, there are often many offensive sentenses going on there in Irc or other chat lines.any comment?
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Kyoun
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shashin@lala.com
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Hi,
I think, sometimes, chat line like Irc should have some sort of censoring
function or administration role not just operators banning/kicking users. what do other people think about this?
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Nobody
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I am a socialist,but it is hard for me to express my opinions,because I am an American,and the right is in control here.
I believe democracy is one of the fundamental things. I think that radical communists of today have betrayed the movement and dare call themselves socialist.Oppressive government is not the answer,the people must be in control.Marx,Lenin,and Trotsky understood this.Stalinism is what destroyed Communism credibility.I applaud genuine Marxists,but any who belive in opressionist communism needs to wake up.
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Larry
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lscartz@dc.jones.com
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Does anyone have information on the identity
of the individual on Omaha Beach that is
frequently shown just running out of the
water and is shot and falls? Did he live? If
dead, is he buried at the cemetery at Omaha
Beach?
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sparkle
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none
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I am doin a research paper on recycled
fashion trends, you know, nostalgia, like
how retro is back. got any ideas where to
get info?
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Andy Capp
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For my Pal Chris Unmilitant,Loved the bit about everyone in LM magazine
being middle class, etc. Bought a copy of it
once. Not enough pictures, though.
Keep Smilin'! Andy.
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God
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colinharcus@Mistral.co.uk
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Some of the time I enjoy all this shit and the rest of the time it sucks. Living in London may be cool for some but for me it is just a drag. If we all have to live in one place why can't it be miles from me.
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Bryan
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STATS2000@aol.com
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Anyone know about geneticist Robert Plomin's
most recent "discovery" of a gene related to
intelligence?
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Queen
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gord1690@novell.uidaho.edu
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I am interested in Marxism, socialism, and
communism, but I feel alone. I live in the
United States and have lived a life-style of
the "capitalistic" and realize that this
society is not going to work out. I feel
alone and would like some input and feed
back. please respond
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christian
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lytje@po.ia.dk
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Hello. I�m trying to find some basic informations on Keynes and Friedman could anyone help me out?
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Matt
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jawCrunch
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News is really interesting but alot of its sad :(
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Matt
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jawCrunch
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this kind of chat sucks why arent we in a room???
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Matt
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jawCrunch
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News is really interesting but alot of its sad :(
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Matt
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jawCrunch
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this pan am 103 crash is interesting
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Matt
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jawCrunch
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this pan am 103 crash is interesting
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Fred
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phy4sam@leeds.ac.uk
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Hello is there anybody there?
What do people think about abortion being on
demand???
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Fred
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phy4sam@leeds.ac.uk
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Hello is there anybody there?
What do people think about abortion being on
demand???
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Zog
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..
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Anyone here?I think not.Anyway,LM's been a
good read so far,and I find it rather amusing
that New Labour seems to be heading in the
same direction as the lot that rule the place
where I'm from.As for those who insist on
slagging off Marxism,I don't believe it's
dead or unworkable,it's just that the wrong
people have tried to apply in this century.Go
read Marx yourself before judging.
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Russell
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stix06@sprynet.com
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I'm calling from Los Angeles. I'm 16 years
old. In March I'll be making my first trip
out of the USA to London for nine days.
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wanda
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wandaliz@csd.uwm.edu
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I have to do an essay on how I see the
distribution of power in the US, and I cannot
believe I took this class. I thought
politics were interesting, but now I see that
teachers don' share my view of politics. I
just needed to tell that to someone.
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Bernie
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zami@pinos.com.ar
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Well, if there's still someone awake, just read this:
I think that it is very good if you are marxist, but I don't think that the marxist system is still going to work. in fact, it didn't work very well yet. I suppose that the system that will triumph is a social-capitalist one.
Is someone there? Just answer me.
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RURIK
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Are you people stupid? Typical Communists.
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Rurik
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ANSWER ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Rurik
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Are you commies? Because if you are I got some words to say to you. First of all Comunism sucks and has been proven through time to fail. So, you socialitic reds who are tring to ruin are countries leave go back to China or wherever. Second Look at U.S.S.R. , Korea, Cuba and many other communistic countries and look at what happened( or going to happen to them) to them. There's a synanym for a communist country it is called hell.
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tony
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although LM is a good read it doesn't update readers on actions taking place in the UK or around the world. although intellectual stimulation is all very well action to change things is also neccessary. praxis rules ok. so what about it LM.
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Gerry Healy
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paperbackcentre@clapham.uk
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I think your page is basically good, since it
gives socialists from all around the world to
discuss. What I don�t like is that you hold
all the regular chats (scheduled) very often.
And when it comes to freeform, you all to
often let complete right wing silly cunts as
"Chris Unmilitant" dominate. If you have made
such a good page, let it be used as a real
RESOURCE for socialists, not for right wing
bastards! Yours comradely:
(Spirit of) Gerry Healy
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shiraz
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bnshiraz@hotmail.com
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i believe that capitalism is a system which
increases the difference between the classes
in the society. it is a system where the
minority rich people can enjoy.
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shiraz
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bnshiraz@hotmail.com
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i believe that capitalism is a system which
makes increases the difference between
classes. it is a system where the minority
rich people can enjoy.
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Terry
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Tezzimodo@aol.com
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I am an American who has been a Royal Watcher. My roots are from England and I lived in Wolverhampton for a couple years.
Diana's death was like baiting sharks with blood. . .every shark has scurried over to get his piece of flesh. I am not sure that this "world gone mad" situation is as much diefication of Diana as it is a way to make some quick money by getting the scoop. The world got caught up in the whole thing. Sorta like Hitler *charming* the Nazis into doing the most horrible things, the *entrepreneurs in media* are pulling the emotional strings of the world. . .and we are letting it happen. We eat it up.
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CHRIS RUMSEY
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CHRISR@DECISIONS-GROUP.COM
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Is Living Marxism just a intellectual wanking
ground for arrogant bastards ?All I have ever seen or heard from L.M. is an
ability to criticise the current status quo
and those that operate within it. The idea is always to criticise but never to
consider the frailities and potential
pitfalls of a Marxist system. When asked a
question about how something would work in
the Living Marxists utopian world he or she
can always go back to the 'Oh but until we
reach it I can't really say' or then again
just go on the counter defensive with the
usual intellectual snobbery and once again
slag off the status quo........ Yours ranting and raving
Chris Unmillitant P.S. Stop wanking start living you pseudo
working (middle class intellectuals)
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Gerry Healy
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paperbackcentre@clapham.uk
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The death of lady Di was indeed a dreadful thing - is gives bourgeois media a chance to launch a massive propaganda war - I do however think that socialists (no matter if you consider yourself being an anti-pabloite, third campist or whatever) should discuss this serious too. Comrades all over the world have reported to me that it�s on TV all the time, all channels. The royal families could indeed get away easy, using the death to bolster sympathy for them and thus aiding a new wave of anglo-imperialism. Just think about the "peace"talks. The death of Di could perhaps spur imperialist feelings (which it will) within the unionist communities. Socialists must combat this and refuse to let the monarchy and bourgeoisie to win a propaganda war. It�s time to mobilise for proletarian republicanism within the unions and CLPs. Now more than ever!
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Tapiwa Ngara
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engaras@iafrica.com
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I am researching for a debate on whether governments everywhere should be allowed to use force to control the population
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JOHN HAIDER PARADA
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COLOMBIA pererira
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En colombia sur america se lamenta la muerte
de LADY DIANA. y tambien compartimos el dolor
de la gente de su pais con gratitud JOHN Y LUISA
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Jasan
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jasan@pathcom.com
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I am reading all comments. And think that we are very close to socialism because of this pure fact, the world wide capitalism system are very causios and cannot have a good sleep at night. These all precaution preparation for every move they make are all because of that. We, socialists and communists, are in the very strong position but we ourself , because of too many scaterings, do not know this simple reality.
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snelli
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What I really worry about is why young people
today do not stand up to government. During
the 60s we were very scarey to the Government
in the USA. One huge united force.. What
happened? Don't these kids care?
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snelli
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I fear we are already too far gone..
The world wide corporations are now
in charge everywhere! Governments have
sold out like Saturday night whores to
Big Business.
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ACE
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none
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Anyone Like Doctor Who?
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John Cowan
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4jdc@qlink.queensu.ca
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I am frightfully concerned about the
potential lost opportunity for socialists
around the globe. With the global capitalist
environment shedding its middle class and
governments stomping on unions one would
think that we were on the brink of the
realization of class consciousness at last.However, with such a scattered movement
between Marxists, Leninists, Democratic
Socialists, Libertarian Socialists and
general left leaning mainstreamers I fear
that will again ignore opportunity knocking. If we are going to get our shit together one
single movement must emerge before the dawn
of the new century..... My vote would go to the movement that draws
the line in the sand; the movement that
fosters the realization that Capitalism CAN
never have a lasting place for petty
bourgious wannabe's and proletarians that
think harmony is attainable...... any comments??????
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Gerry_Healy
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North@Torrence
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ICP has become the the cosy liberal shitty
SEP, the Workers Press "Reclaim the future"
and the Socialist Future people are preparing
to launch a joint int�l with stalinsis. What
has happened to the lunatics on the UK left
wing? What will come next? ICC and CWO
campaigning for unionisation? CPGB/Weekly
Worker campaigning for new labour votes in
by-elections? I kind of miss the nuttiness of
theese people.
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